[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I went as a back-up. The plan was I'd stay there a year, and David Wolf would go fly the last increment on Mir and I would come back and do something else. I actually undertook that mostly because I was curious about the Russian environment and so on, not expecting that I would get a flight out of it. But I did. I got to fly when the crew reassignments were made, and I feel very privileged that I was one of the seven people that served on this vehicle. It's just amazing to even contemplate that, actually, in hindsight.

[Assistant] And how did your family take the announcement that you were going to be gone so far away?

[User] Well, I don't think they minded that so much. I said, "I'm going to Russia for a year to just be a non-flight training back-up."\n\n They just sort of thought, "Well, that's an unusual thing to do, but you're coming back?"\n\n "Yes, yes, I'll be coming back."\n\n But I noticed the conversation got decidedly quiet when I announced that crews had been reassigned and that I was, in fact, going to fly on this vehicle. But I think they trusted my judgment and knew that I wasn't going to do anything impetuous or foolhardy.

[Assistant] Are they concerned because of all the information that had been released of concerns for safety of Mir?

[User] They never vocalized any concerns, but I've noticed that since I've got back they've vocalized a lot of relief that I'm back. I think they trusted my judgment. All the time I was on that vehicle, I felt safe. I never felt threatened. I thought it was a fascinating way to spend four and a half months, and I never felt any sense of impending danger or any problem like that.

[Assistant] We all get into routines every day, like you mentioned earlier. Was something more than others that you realized that you couldn't do your routine, something that you do every day here, but up there it changed?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The thing you notice the most is the lack of options for what you can do. Here you can get in a car and drive up into town or go to a restaurant or go visit a friend or go to a movie or go to the beach, and you have that mobility that provides you a lot of options in what you can do. That's not the case up there. You don't have a lot of options. That's why I talked about recreation being important. You have to exploit the environment for whatever you can to give you as much interesting activities as you can find. So that was the biggest thing, was just not having a lot of options.\n\n Of course, I flew with a good crew. I'm lucky I flew with them. I feel they were good guys. But there is only two other people you see the whole time. You don't have a lot of diversity in the people you see over the course of that four-and-a-half-month period.

[Assistant] You were with two other crewmembers, other than you were with two Russians. You felt like you were all a crew working together?

[User] Yes. Oh, yes, yes. I definitely felt that we were a team up there, and to their credit, I'll say they worked hard to make sure that that was the way everyone felt, and that was what they wanted, too, because, you know, they were in the same environment I was. They had the same needs, and if any one of them had not been sort of integrated as a crew, it would have been tough on them, too.

[Assistant] Of course, you left them and they're still there. Have you communicated with them at all since you've been down?

[User] No, I haven't. Mir is going to be flying over, possibly visible tomorrow night, so it's going to be interesting, the first time I actually get to see it go over now that I'm back. That will be interesting.

[Assistant] How was it to look over your shoulder and see that you were flying off in the Shuttle and leaving them behind?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Oh, yes, yes. I definitely felt that we were a team up there, and to their credit, I'll say they worked hard to make sure that that was the way everyone felt, and that was what they wanted, too, because, you know, they were in the same environment I was. They had the same needs, and if any one of them had not been sort of integrated as a crew, it would have been tough on them, too.

[Assistant] Of course, you left them and they're still there. Have you communicated with them at all since you've been down?

[User] No, I haven't. Mir is going to be flying over, possibly visible tomorrow night, so it's going to be interesting, the first time I actually get to see it go over now that I'm back. That will be interesting.

[Assistant] How was it to look over your shoulder and see that you were flying off in the Shuttle and leaving them behind?

[User] It was fascinating, because, you know, I'd spent four and a half months on Mir, but it was inside Mir. I really didn't see the outside of the vehicle. I'd seen it briefly when we first docked, but not a lot. So the fascinating part was that as we pulled away and did a fly-around, I was able for the first time to get to see the outside of what had been my home for twenty weeks. That was really interesting. I'd say, "Oh, yes, I know that window. I used to look out that window. Oh, is that what that was? I wondered what that thing was." And so that was kind of fun.

[Assistant] Your crewmates did go out. You said they had done an EVA.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No, I haven't. Mir is going to be flying over, possibly visible tomorrow night, so it's going to be interesting, the first time I actually get to see it go over now that I'm back. That will be interesting.

[Assistant] How was it to look over your shoulder and see that you were flying off in the Shuttle and leaving them behind?

[User] It was fascinating, because, you know, I'd spent four and a half months on Mir, but it was inside Mir. I really didn't see the outside of the vehicle. I'd seen it briefly when we first docked, but not a lot. So the fascinating part was that as we pulled away and did a fly-around, I was able for the first time to get to see the outside of what had been my home for twenty weeks. That was really interesting. I'd say, "Oh, yes, I know that window. I used to look out that window. Oh, is that what that was? I wondered what that thing was." And so that was kind of fun.

[Assistant] Your crewmates did go out. You said they had done an EVA.

[User] They did five EVAs, yes.

[Assistant] What were your duties while they were busy on the outside?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was fascinating, because, you know, I'd spent four and a half months on Mir, but it was inside Mir. I really didn't see the outside of the vehicle. I'd seen it briefly when we first docked, but not a lot. So the fascinating part was that as we pulled away and did a fly-around, I was able for the first time to get to see the outside of what had been my home for twenty weeks. That was really interesting. I'd say, "Oh, yes, I know that window. I used to look out that window. Oh, is that what that was? I wondered what that thing was." And so that was kind of fun.

[Assistant] Your crewmates did go out. You said they had done an EVA.

[User] They did five EVAs, yes.

[Assistant] What were your duties while they were busy on the outside?

[User] Most of the time I was glued to the windows, photographing their activities while they did the work, and also taking care of anything that came up inside the station if something did. There were a few calls from the ground to check a few things while they were outdoors. But, yes, they did thirty hours of EVA, and five of them. They did one series of EVAs to repair a solar array on the Spektr module that had been damaged in the collision, to brace it up, to give it some strength, and the other one was to replace an engine which is out on a boom out here that's used for controlling the attitude of the station. So they came out and climbed up this tall boom that's mounted on the station and replaced this engine. There was quite a lot of work that they did.

[Assistant] Were you envious that they were there and you were inside? Did you want to be out there with them?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] They did five EVAs, yes.

[Assistant] What were your duties while they were busy on the outside?

[User] Most of the time I was glued to the windows, photographing their activities while they did the work, and also taking care of anything that came up inside the station if something did. There were a few calls from the ground to check a few things while they were outdoors. But, yes, they did thirty hours of EVA, and five of them. They did one series of EVAs to repair a solar array on the Spektr module that had been damaged in the collision, to brace it up, to give it some strength, and the other one was to replace an engine which is out on a boom out here that's used for controlling the attitude of the station. So they came out and climbed up this tall boom that's mounted on the station and replaced this engine. There was quite a lot of work that they did.

[Assistant] Were you envious that they were there and you were inside? Did you want to be out there with them?

[User] Well, I would like to have tried it, but I have to say, thirty hours of EVA is hard, hard work. They worked very hard, and they have my respect for that because it was not an easy thing that they did, by any means. I didn't envy the hard work.

[Assistant] The experiments that you performed while you were there, will you be able to follow the results once you're home?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Most of the time I was glued to the windows, photographing their activities while they did the work, and also taking care of anything that came up inside the station if something did. There were a few calls from the ground to check a few things while they were outdoors. But, yes, they did thirty hours of EVA, and five of them. They did one series of EVAs to repair a solar array on the Spektr module that had been damaged in the collision, to brace it up, to give it some strength, and the other one was to replace an engine which is out on a boom out here that's used for controlling the attitude of the station. So they came out and climbed up this tall boom that's mounted on the station and replaced this engine. There was quite a lot of work that they did.

[Assistant] Were you envious that they were there and you were inside? Did you want to be out there with them?

[User] Well, I would like to have tried it, but I have to say, thirty hours of EVA is hard, hard work. They worked very hard, and they have my respect for that because it was not an easy thing that they did, by any means. I didn't envy the hard work.

[Assistant] The experiments that you performed while you were there, will you be able to follow the results once you're home?

[User] I won't be following them, but they're going to be providing me some briefings on them from time to time--I suppose that's following them, isn't it?--and giving me updates on what they find. It's still too early yet. I haven't had feedback from the results yet. It'll be some time before I do, too. There's a fairly complex analysis needed.

[Assistant] Did you have a favorite of all the ones that you were working on?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, I would like to have tried it, but I have to say, thirty hours of EVA is hard, hard work. They worked very hard, and they have my respect for that because it was not an easy thing that they did, by any means. I didn't envy the hard work.

[Assistant] The experiments that you performed while you were there, will you be able to follow the results once you're home?

[User] I won't be following them, but they're going to be providing me some briefings on them from time to time--I suppose that's following them, isn't it?--and giving me updates on what they find. It's still too early yet. I haven't had feedback from the results yet. It'll be some time before I do, too. There's a fairly complex analysis needed.

[Assistant] Did you have a favorite of all the ones that you were working on?

[User] No. I enjoyed them all, because they provided activity, stimulating activity. The biotechnology experiment, growing the cells in the bioreactor, was perhaps the most time-consuming. I'd say that was the one that got most of my attention. That's the one I'm sort of going to be interested to see what the outcome of that was, and it also gave quite a lot of problems during the flight which required a bit of careful work to overcome. So it remains to be seen what the outcome of all that is.

[Assistant] At the end of the flight, there was a computer glitch.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I won't be following them, but they're going to be providing me some briefings on them from time to time--I suppose that's following them, isn't it?--and giving me updates on what they find. It's still too early yet. I haven't had feedback from the results yet. It'll be some time before I do, too. There's a fairly complex analysis needed.

[Assistant] Did you have a favorite of all the ones that you were working on?

[User] No. I enjoyed them all, because they provided activity, stimulating activity. The biotechnology experiment, growing the cells in the bioreactor, was perhaps the most time-consuming. I'd say that was the one that got most of my attention. That's the one I'm sort of going to be interested to see what the outcome of that was, and it also gave quite a lot of problems during the flight which required a bit of careful work to overcome. So it remains to be seen what the outcome of all that is.

[Assistant] At the end of the flight, there was a computer glitch.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Did that give you little anxious feelings of maybe your flight home was going to be delayed?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No. I enjoyed them all, because they provided activity, stimulating activity. The biotechnology experiment, growing the cells in the bioreactor, was perhaps the most time-consuming. I'd say that was the one that got most of my attention. That's the one I'm sort of going to be interested to see what the outcome of that was, and it also gave quite a lot of problems during the flight which required a bit of careful work to overcome. So it remains to be seen what the outcome of all that is.

[Assistant] At the end of the flight, there was a computer glitch.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Did that give you little anxious feelings of maybe your flight home was going to be delayed?

[User] Yes, it was a concern. The Shuttle was to launch on a Tuesday, and the Saturday before that, just before I was supposed to give a press conference, the attitude-control computer failed, and I thought it was unbelievably bad timing. After twenty weeks this happens and just before a press conference, because one of the things I was going to say in the press conference was how problem-free the flight had been and so on. It turned out the press conference had to be canceled. But I was concerned that if they didn't have attitude control, which meant that the station would be slowly rotating, it wouldn't be possible to dock the Shuttle to it, in which case they would delay the launch until it did get control back.\n\n But they worked very hard to change out the computer and reestablish operations, which they had done within a day, I think, a day and a half, perhaps--yes, a day and a half, and so the Shuttle was launching on time and came on time. But for a while there I was thinking, "Hmm. Wonder when I'm going to see the Shuttle?"

[Assistant] Did you see it approaching?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] Did that give you little anxious feelings of maybe your flight home was going to be delayed?

[User] Yes, it was a concern. The Shuttle was to launch on a Tuesday, and the Saturday before that, just before I was supposed to give a press conference, the attitude-control computer failed, and I thought it was unbelievably bad timing. After twenty weeks this happens and just before a press conference, because one of the things I was going to say in the press conference was how problem-free the flight had been and so on. It turned out the press conference had to be canceled. But I was concerned that if they didn't have attitude control, which meant that the station would be slowly rotating, it wouldn't be possible to dock the Shuttle to it, in which case they would delay the launch until it did get control back.\n\n But they worked very hard to change out the computer and reestablish operations, which they had done within a day, I think, a day and a half, perhaps--yes, a day and a half, and so the Shuttle was launching on time and came on time. But for a while there I was thinking, "Hmm. Wonder when I'm going to see the Shuttle?"

[Assistant] Did you see it approaching?

[User] Oh, yes. I saw it first as a point of light out on the horizon, like a bright star. Then you could get binoculars and you could look at it. You could just make out that it was not a star, that it actually was the Shuttle. Then, of course, it came closer and you could see it clearly, and I got some spectacular photos of it just floating around next to us to come up underneath and dock to us. It just got closer and closer, and then at one point you feel the whole station shudder, and you know that they've made contact and have latched on. So it was a great moment.

[Assistant] And I guess the next great moment was when they opened the hatch?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, yes. I saw it first as a point of light out on the horizon, like a bright star. Then you could get binoculars and you could look at it. You could just make out that it was not a star, that it actually was the Shuttle. Then, of course, it came closer and you could see it clearly, and I got some spectacular photos of it just floating around next to us to come up underneath and dock to us. It just got closer and closer, and then at one point you feel the whole station shudder, and you know that they've made contact and have latched on. So it was a great moment.

[Assistant] And I guess the next great moment was when they opened the hatch?

[User] Yes. At that point I knew I was going home. And we had a good time. We spent time together socializing and saying goodbye and packing up, and after three days closed the hatch, made sure I was on the Shuttle side of it, waved goodbye, and slowly pulled away, and then did the fly-around, when I got to look at my home for the last four months.\n\n Perhaps one of the most moving moments, though, was as we drew further and further away, we went into the night side of the planet, and I could see stars, and the running lights of the station were on. You couldn't see the station. All you could see was lights flashing, and they were just going off into the distance, these flashing points of light fading out slowly. That was kind of an emotional moment, because I knew that would be the last time I would see it--ever. And that's been the case, too.

[Assistant] You rode home with one of the people who were very instrumental in having Mir.

[User] Yes, Valeri Ryumin.

[Assistant] Did you get a chance to visit, to share any information on the way?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. At that point I knew I was going home. And we had a good time. We spent time together socializing and saying goodbye and packing up, and after three days closed the hatch, made sure I was on the Shuttle side of it, waved goodbye, and slowly pulled away, and then did the fly-around, when I got to look at my home for the last four months.\n\n Perhaps one of the most moving moments, though, was as we drew further and further away, we went into the night side of the planet, and I could see stars, and the running lights of the station were on. You couldn't see the station. All you could see was lights flashing, and they were just going off into the distance, these flashing points of light fading out slowly. That was kind of an emotional moment, because I knew that would be the last time I would see it--ever. And that's been the case, too.

[Assistant] You rode home with one of the people who were very instrumental in having Mir.

[User] Yes, Valeri Ryumin.

[Assistant] Did you get a chance to visit, to share any information on the way?

[User] Not a lot during the Shuttle flight. He spent a lot of time on Mir while I was doing the transfer of all the bags and things that I'd packed, and it's my understanding he's going to be preparing some kind of report on the Mir for the Russian Space Agency. I would assume, and I certainly hope, that we would get a copy of that, to see what their interpretation of it is.

[Assistant] You were the last American, probably will be the last American there.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, Valeri Ryumin.

[Assistant] Did you get a chance to visit, to share any information on the way?

[User] Not a lot during the Shuttle flight. He spent a lot of time on Mir while I was doing the transfer of all the bags and things that I'd packed, and it's my understanding he's going to be preparing some kind of report on the Mir for the Russian Space Agency. I would assume, and I certainly hope, that we would get a copy of that, to see what their interpretation of it is.

[Assistant] You were the last American, probably will be the last American there.

[User] Definitely will be, yes.

[Assistant] What makes your mission different than the rest?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Definitely will be, yes.

[Assistant] What makes your mission different than the rest?

[User] Well, it was my mission. [Laughter] There were seven people that flew up there. We all had sort of similar science that was undertaken. I think mine was probably the most placid of all of them. The first person, Norm [Norman] Thagard, when he went up there, there were a lot of problems to do with the fact that he was the first, and a lot of the things that you need to sustain yourself I don't think he had. So that must have made it tough for him. I don't think they had the E-mail situation worked out nor the [unclear], things like that. Shannon, when she flew, her flight got extended because of Shuttle problems, actually. So she had to stay up there six months instead of four, and that would have been tough, I think. She has a very good spirit about it, though.\n\n And of course, for Jerry's [Linenger] increment, John Blaha flew. He had a fairly benign increment, too, much like mine. For Jerry there was the fire, of course, and for Mike [Foale] there was the depressurization. So they had some exciting times on theirs.\n\n David [Wolf] had a number of power failures during his. Mine was fairly placid by comparison, which I think is testimony to the capability of the Russians to restore operations, to bring the system back on line, which I think they did well, because I think they recognized that the world was sort of watching what they do with the station, and that they were on the world stage and needed to prove that they could do it, and they did that.

[Assistant] Was this your first dealing, working with the Russian partners?

[User] Yes. I got to know the Russian culture and mentality reasonably well by spending that year in training beforehand. It sort of gave me a sense of the way they think and the way they approach things and so on, and the Russian engineering, the quality of the Russian engineering.

[Assistant] You've been from Australia to American, Russia to Mir, and now back again.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. I got to know the Russian culture and mentality reasonably well by spending that year in training beforehand. It sort of gave me a sense of the way they think and the way they approach things and so on, and the Russian engineering, the quality of the Russian engineering.

[Assistant] You've been from Australia to American, Russia to Mir, and now back again.

[User] I want to stay at home for a while. [Laughter] Yes, I do. Just before I went to Russia, I bought a small house here, which I moved into, only to have to pack up and go to Russia. So I've only just sort of moved into it again. I want to spend time to turn it from a house into a home and enjoy that. For the whole of my time while I was on Mir and the whole of my time training the year before it, my whole life was scheduled. Each day you'd have a piece of paper telling you what you had to do, where you had to be throughout the whole day, and you had to follow that up with hours and hours of study at night because it was all in Russian. It took a long time to read a twenty-page document, a long time.\n\n So I'm looking forward to not having a scheduled life. It still is scheduled, the post-flight activities require that, but I'm looking very much forward to, for a while, having an unscheduled life and be free to do what I wish and come and go and be my own master for a while, and enjoy just building a home, getting back into establishing a home here.

[Assistant] You might even have a pet. You certainly couldn't have pets on Mir.

[User] No. I don't think I want a pet.

[Assistant]
I was going to ask Carol and Summer if they had a question.

Would you say the Shuttle-Mir Program has accomplished everything it set out to?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Well, that's a good question. I guess like lots of momentous decisions I've made in my life, it was just sort of coincidental that someone mentioned Peace Corps to me. So I was finishing up in my active duty time in the Army.

[Assistant] Oh, in the Army.

[User] Which I was an air defense artillery officer down in Fort Bliss, Texas. And so trying to figure out, well, what comes next? And one of my fellow officer friends said, well, you should do the Peace Corps. And I'd certainly heard of the Peace Corps, it's a well-known organization, but I honestly hadn't thought about, hadn't thought about going in. And this was in, I guess, 2003.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] And so I thought about it a little bit and I thought, well, you know, she's right. That sounds really interesting. And so I was also interested in doing graduate school following my time in the Army. So my undergraduate degree's in history, and I had pursued some PhD programs but actually didn't get accepted. So I was thinking, OK, well, what else? And so then started looking at, well, how does, how can we connect grad school as well as its potential for Peace Corps? And so I ended up going to graduate school at the University of Montana. And they were part of the Master's International program that I don't think is running anymore. But it's where the Peace Corps would essentially serve as my research time. So it would be incorporated into the graduate program. And the graduate program was a master's of science in resource conservation. And so that's how it came to be. I applied for graduate school and for the Peace Corps at the same time.

[Assistant] Oh, interesting. And the Peace Corps called first?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Which I was an air defense artillery officer down in Fort Bliss, Texas. And so trying to figure out, well, what comes next? And one of my fellow officer friends said, well, you should do the Peace Corps. And I'd certainly heard of the Peace Corps, it's a well-known organization, but I honestly hadn't thought about, hadn't thought about going in. And this was in, I guess, 2003.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] And so I thought about it a little bit and I thought, well, you know, she's right. That sounds really interesting. And so I was also interested in doing graduate school following my time in the Army. So my undergraduate degree's in history, and I had pursued some PhD programs but actually didn't get accepted. So I was thinking, OK, well, what else? And so then started looking at, well, how does, how can we connect grad school as well as its potential for Peace Corps? And so I ended up going to graduate school at the University of Montana. And they were part of the Master's International program that I don't think is running anymore. But it's where the Peace Corps would essentially serve as my research time. So it would be incorporated into the graduate program. And the graduate program was a master's of science in resource conservation. And so that's how it came to be. I applied for graduate school and for the Peace Corps at the same time.

[Assistant] Oh, interesting. And the Peace Corps called first?

[User] That is a good question.

[Assistant] Because I seem to recall waiting quite a while to hear from them.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And so I thought about it a little bit and I thought, well, you know, she's right. That sounds really interesting. And so I was also interested in doing graduate school following my time in the Army. So my undergraduate degree's in history, and I had pursued some PhD programs but actually didn't get accepted. So I was thinking, OK, well, what else? And so then started looking at, well, how does, how can we connect grad school as well as its potential for Peace Corps? And so I ended up going to graduate school at the University of Montana. And they were part of the Master's International program that I don't think is running anymore. But it's where the Peace Corps would essentially serve as my research time. So it would be incorporated into the graduate program. And the graduate program was a master's of science in resource conservation. And so that's how it came to be. I applied for graduate school and for the Peace Corps at the same time.

[Assistant] Oh, interesting. And the Peace Corps called first?

[User] That is a good question.

[Assistant] Because I seem to recall waiting quite a while to hear from them.

[User] It did take a, it did take a while. Yeah, I think. I think continues to still take. I don't remember the exact timeline.

[Assistant] Was Fiji your first offer?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That is a good question.

[Assistant] Because I seem to recall waiting quite a while to hear from them.

[User] It did take a, it did take a while. Yeah, I think. I think continues to still take. I don't remember the exact timeline.

[Assistant] Was Fiji your first offer?

[User] Fiji was my first offer.

[Assistant] Oh, lucky you.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Fiji was my first offer.

[Assistant] Oh, lucky you.

[User] Yeah. So I got the call. I had already, in fact. So graduate school must have been first because I was at, I was in Missoula at the University of Montana when I got the call. I think it was already spring semester and so the recruiter or the placement officer said, well, what do you? I've got a place for you. Because as part of the Master's International program, I knew that it would be in the environment field.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] That was it. I didn't put any preference for location because my Spanish and French skills are pretty basic, so it wouldn't make the cut for the programs that had that language requirement. But other than that, I was wide open.

[Assistant] But you do have an aptitude for languages then. Did you learn Fijian?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. So I got the call. I had already, in fact. So graduate school must have been first because I was at, I was in Missoula at the University of Montana when I got the call. I think it was already spring semester and so the recruiter or the placement officer said, well, what do you? I've got a place for you. Because as part of the Master's International program, I knew that it would be in the environment field.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] That was it. I didn't put any preference for location because my Spanish and French skills are pretty basic, so it wouldn't make the cut for the programs that had that language requirement. But other than that, I was wide open.

[Assistant] But you do have an aptitude for languages then. Did you learn Fijian?

[User] I did. I did. Yeah, and it's, um, that was one of my motivations for going into the Peace Corps. I was, I really love languages and love trying to learn them. It's, I have an aptitude for it, I would say. But of course, it's still a challenge.

[Assistant] So before we get too far into Fiji. So what did you do with all your stuff, your personal belongings and everything while you were gone for two years?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] That was it. I didn't put any preference for location because my Spanish and French skills are pretty basic, so it wouldn't make the cut for the programs that had that language requirement. But other than that, I was wide open.

[Assistant] But you do have an aptitude for languages then. Did you learn Fijian?

[User] I did. I did. Yeah, and it's, um, that was one of my motivations for going into the Peace Corps. I was, I really love languages and love trying to learn them. It's, I have an aptitude for it, I would say. But of course, it's still a challenge.

[Assistant] So before we get too far into Fiji. So what did you do with all your stuff, your personal belongings and everything while you were gone for two years?

[User] While I was gone. Well, I originally grew up in Helena, Montana, so it was only a hundred miles away and I had moved up. I finished active duty service with the Army in 2003, moved stuff back up to Montana, and I think my, uh, I think my dad absorbed it all in his house and some went to my brother. I actually loaned my car to a friend for a couple of years. So, yeah, I didn't have too much still.

[Assistant] Sounds like a win win.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I did. I did. Yeah, and it's, um, that was one of my motivations for going into the Peace Corps. I was, I really love languages and love trying to learn them. It's, I have an aptitude for it, I would say. But of course, it's still a challenge.

[Assistant] So before we get too far into Fiji. So what did you do with all your stuff, your personal belongings and everything while you were gone for two years?

[User] While I was gone. Well, I originally grew up in Helena, Montana, so it was only a hundred miles away and I had moved up. I finished active duty service with the Army in 2003, moved stuff back up to Montana, and I think my, uh, I think my dad absorbed it all in his house and some went to my brother. I actually loaned my car to a friend for a couple of years. So, yeah, I didn't have too much still.

[Assistant] Sounds like a win win.

[User] I was young and pretty young and single and little more than just what could fit in the car.

[Assistant] I want to ask you, did the Army help prepare you for Peace Corps?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] While I was gone. Well, I originally grew up in Helena, Montana, so it was only a hundred miles away and I had moved up. I finished active duty service with the Army in 2003, moved stuff back up to Montana, and I think my, uh, I think my dad absorbed it all in his house and some went to my brother. I actually loaned my car to a friend for a couple of years. So, yeah, I didn't have too much still.

[Assistant] Sounds like a win win.

[User] I was young and pretty young and single and little more than just what could fit in the car.

[Assistant] I want to ask you, did the Army help prepare you for Peace Corps?

[User] Yes and no. Yes in that you certainly need to learn to adapt. You're going to be flexible to a variety of environments, could be adverse conditions, but pretty flexible and flexible in coming into a situation just trying to understand what's happening there and acclimating.

[Assistant] A little survival training too, right?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] A little bit, a little bit. Not as much as maybe you would hope for. I bet they do more of it now, but I'd say no in that the Army is pretty structured.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] And there's the right way to do it and wrong way. Now there is room for creativity and thinking on your feet and all. But then the Peace Corps and especially Fiji and Fiji time, right, was a polar opposite. But I will say that the Fijians that I worked with, especially the indigenous Fijians, really highly respected military service.

[Assistant] Oh yeah.

[User] And so they were actually really confused. How? Why on earth would I have gotten out of the Army? Which is this prestigious occupation that many of them, especially the men, hope to be able to go serve with the British military or others. And here I am, choosing to get out of the Army and to come to Fiji as a Peace Corps volunteer. So that confused them a little bit.

[Assistant] Yeah. Uh-huh. Interesting. You mentioned Fiji time. Tell me what that is.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And so they were actually really confused. How? Why on earth would I have gotten out of the Army? Which is this prestigious occupation that many of them, especially the men, hope to be able to go serve with the British military or others. And here I am, choosing to get out of the Army and to come to Fiji as a Peace Corps volunteer. So that confused them a little bit.

[Assistant] Yeah. Uh-huh. Interesting. You mentioned Fiji time. Tell me what that is.

[User] So it's just the sort of non clock based, much slower pace, you know, I think often general sense of island time.

[Assistant] Yeah. OK.

[User] So in Fiji, specifically what I can remember is, it seemed like if I would press and say, well, when is this event going to start? It would either start at 9:00 or at 1:00. And nine o'clock meant sometime in the morning, probably before lunch, and one o'clock meant probably sometime before dinner.

[Assistant] Or maybe tomorrow.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So it's just the sort of non clock based, much slower pace, you know, I think often general sense of island time.

[Assistant] Yeah. OK.

[User] So in Fiji, specifically what I can remember is, it seemed like if I would press and say, well, when is this event going to start? It would either start at 9:00 or at 1:00. And nine o'clock meant sometime in the morning, probably before lunch, and one o'clock meant probably sometime before dinner.

[Assistant] Or maybe tomorrow.

[User] And tomorrow was potentially never.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'm sure we would call the coconut wireless.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And tomorrow was potentially never.

[Assistant] Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'm sure we would call the coconut wireless.

[User] Oh, indeed, indeed. Among Peace Corps volunteers. Now, of course, in my era we did have email.

[Assistant] Oh.

[User] So we weren't all connected quite like I imagine volunteers are now, but we could go to an internet cafe and actually be in touch.

[Assistant] Oh boy, that's a big difference. Well, I want to hear all about that when we talk about Fiji a little bit more but.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, indeed, indeed. Among Peace Corps volunteers. Now, of course, in my era we did have email.

[Assistant] Oh.

[User] So we weren't all connected quite like I imagine volunteers are now, but we could go to an internet cafe and actually be in touch.

[Assistant] Oh boy, that's a big difference. Well, I want to hear all about that when we talk about Fiji a little bit more but.

[User] You bet.

[Assistant] Where did you learn the language? Where was your training held?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You bet.

[Assistant] Where did you learn the language? Where was your training held?

[User] So our training was just outside of Suva at, I believe it's called Nandave, and it was a vocational training center for, I can't remember if it's young men and women or just young men.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] But we held about, we were there for about two weeks, I believe. And then we went out with host families at a series of villages. And unfortunately, I can't right off the top of my head remember the name of my fantastic village where we did our training.

[Assistant] Yeah, we should have a map in front of us, but maybe we can reference one later on.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So our training was just outside of Suva at, I believe it's called Nandave, and it was a vocational training center for, I can't remember if it's young men and women or just young men.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] But we held about, we were there for about two weeks, I believe. And then we went out with host families at a series of villages. And unfortunately, I can't right off the top of my head remember the name of my fantastic village where we did our training.

[Assistant] Yeah, we should have a map in front of us, but maybe we can reference one later on.

[User] Sure.

[Assistant] OK, so two weeks and then a village stay. Or several villages.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Sure.

[Assistant] OK, so two weeks and then a village stay. Or several villages.

[User] So we were each assigned to different villages. There was a group of, I'd say, about five of us in the village. And so there was a language trainer and we learned the standard Fijian or known as the Bauan language. And so that was the, that was our kind of primary schooling. And then our host family, you know, would help with that too. And so I was with a family, with a mother, her adult daughter, and then the daughter's two children.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] And all of the, the elder, the grandmother there, she knew some English, but she wouldn't speak it to me. She knew that I was supposed to learn Fijian.

[Assistant] Good for her.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So we were each assigned to different villages. There was a group of, I'd say, about five of us in the village. And so there was a language trainer and we learned the standard Fijian or known as the Bauan language. And so that was the, that was our kind of primary schooling. And then our host family, you know, would help with that too. And so I was with a family, with a mother, her adult daughter, and then the daughter's two children.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] And all of the, the elder, the grandmother there, she knew some English, but she wouldn't speak it to me. She knew that I was supposed to learn Fijian.

[Assistant] Good for her.

[User] And the kids, the kids helped. So I would say I had a wonderful family who really took an interest in helping me learn the language.

[Assistant] Oh, that's great. Yeah, nice. So from the language, so you did all your training in country?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And all of the, the elder, the grandmother there, she knew some English, but she wouldn't speak it to me. She knew that I was supposed to learn Fijian.

[Assistant] Good for her.

[User] And the kids, the kids helped. So I would say I had a wonderful family who really took an interest in helping me learn the language.

[Assistant] Oh, that's great. Yeah, nice. So from the language, so you did all your training in country?

[User] Yes, except for a three-day pre-service in Los Angeles.

[Assistant] Oh, just staging.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes, except for a three-day pre-service in Los Angeles.

[Assistant] Oh, just staging.

[User] The staging, exactly.

[Assistant] Yeah, OK.

[User] But yes, the rest was in Fiji.

[Assistant] Did you happen to drink kava while you were in the training?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The staging, exactly.

[Assistant] Yeah, OK.

[User] But yes, the rest was in Fiji.

[Assistant] Did you happen to drink kava while you were in the training?

[User] Yeah, apparently that was definitely a key part of the training.

[Assistant] So tell us about kava.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] But yes, the rest was in Fiji.

[Assistant] Did you happen to drink kava while you were in the training?

[User] Yeah, apparently that was definitely a key part of the training.

[Assistant] So tell us about kava.

[User] We did. So kava, or in Fijian known as yagona, which is made from the roots of a pepper plant. And it was sort of humorously called dirty water, but it kind of looks and kind of tastes like dirty water. But it's, you know, it's common in really across a lot of Pacific islands and Fiji, they get in into the drinking yagona. It's part of just every community.

[Assistant] It's kind of like the passport into a village, as I recall,


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, apparently that was definitely a key part of the training.

[Assistant] So tell us about kava.

[User] We did. So kava, or in Fijian known as yagona, which is made from the roots of a pepper plant. And it was sort of humorously called dirty water, but it kind of looks and kind of tastes like dirty water. But it's, you know, it's common in really across a lot of Pacific islands and Fiji, they get in into the drinking yagona. It's part of just every community.

[Assistant] It's kind of like the passport into a village, as I recall,

[User] It is, it is. It's part of what's called the sevusevu or offering when. So if you're going into a new place, including when we got to our sites and even, you know, when we certainly the ground had already been laid for us to the training, the training villages. But my guess is that there was one of the Fijian Peace Corps staff went in and did a sevusevu where they offer a big bundle of kava and some kind of ceremonial talk goes back and forth.

[Assistant] Did you ever learn the presentation of the kava?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] We did. So kava, or in Fijian known as yagona, which is made from the roots of a pepper plant. And it was sort of humorously called dirty water, but it kind of looks and kind of tastes like dirty water. But it's, you know, it's common in really across a lot of Pacific islands and Fiji, they get in into the drinking yagona. It's part of just every community.

[Assistant] It's kind of like the passport into a village, as I recall,

[User] It is, it is. It's part of what's called the sevusevu or offering when. So if you're going into a new place, including when we got to our sites and even, you know, when we certainly the ground had already been laid for us to the training, the training villages. But my guess is that there was one of the Fijian Peace Corps staff went in and did a sevusevu where they offer a big bundle of kava and some kind of ceremonial talk goes back and forth.

[Assistant] Did you ever learn the presentation of the kava?

[User] Not, not perfectly.

[Assistant] Because usually the chief would have a spokesperson, but I learned it if you'd like to hear a little bit of Fijian for the record, or would you like to say something?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It is, it is. It's part of what's called the sevusevu or offering when. So if you're going into a new place, including when we got to our sites and even, you know, when we certainly the ground had already been laid for us to the training, the training villages. But my guess is that there was one of the Fijian Peace Corps staff went in and did a sevusevu where they offer a big bundle of kava and some kind of ceremonial talk goes back and forth.

[Assistant] Did you ever learn the presentation of the kava?

[User] Not, not perfectly.

[Assistant] Because usually the chief would have a spokesperson, but I learned it if you'd like to hear a little bit of Fijian for the record, or would you like to say something?

[User] Oh, it's too rusty.

[Assistant] Well, let's have a little conversation. Ni sa bula, Paul.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not, not perfectly.

[Assistant] Because usually the chief would have a spokesperson, but I learned it if you'd like to hear a little bit of Fijian for the record, or would you like to say something?

[User] Oh, it's too rusty.

[Assistant] Well, let's have a little conversation. Ni sa bula, Paul.

[User] Sa bula vinaka.

[Assistant] Sa vacava tiko? How are you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh, it's too rusty.

[Assistant] Well, let's have a little conversation. Ni sa bula, Paul.

[User] Sa bula vinaka.

[Assistant] Sa vacava tiko? How are you?

[User] Uh, sorry, I have some Spanish mixed in there now too.

[Assistant] Isn't that how it goes?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Sa bula vinaka.

[Assistant] Sa vacava tiko? How are you?

[User] Uh, sorry, I have some Spanish mixed in there now too.

[Assistant] Isn't that how it goes?

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Well, let me do this sevusevu, because I should have brought some kava to present to you because I'm here in your office. So let's just pretend that this recorder is some yagona. [speaks Fijian] So that was in the northern island dialect, which probably sounded a little different than what you're used to speaking.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Uh, sorry, I have some Spanish mixed in there now too.

[Assistant] Isn't that how it goes?

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Well, let me do this sevusevu, because I should have brought some kava to present to you because I'm here in your office. So let's just pretend that this recorder is some yagona. [speaks Fijian] So that was in the northern island dialect, which probably sounded a little different than what you're used to speaking.

[User] A little bit. But excellent. Well done. Well done.

[Assistant] I remembered it over the years, and practiced it.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] Well, let me do this sevusevu, because I should have brought some kava to present to you because I'm here in your office. So let's just pretend that this recorder is some yagona. [speaks Fijian] So that was in the northern island dialect, which probably sounded a little different than what you're used to speaking.

[User] A little bit. But excellent. Well done. Well done.

[Assistant] I remembered it over the years, and practiced it.

[User] I think certainly mine's gotten rusty. But yeah, so I did learn a little bit, but definitely in. And so where I was located in Cuvu village was in western Viti Levu. So the main island, about a little closer between Nadi and Suva.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. Sigatoka. On the south side, I believe.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. And just about six miles west, right next to the Shangri- La Fijian Resort. So big, big resort along the coral coast.

[Assistant] Nice.

[User] And the language there is, linguists considered a separate language.

[Assistant] Do they?

[User] And so. So for example, [speaks Fijian], right? I'm full or I'm hungry in the nandrolone dialect is [speaks Fijian]. So it's just, it's just different. Even grammatically, there's some structural differences so that the present tense indicator is at the end of the sentence. So there's enough changes both in the grammar, the lexicon, and just the sounds, the phonics of it.

[Assistant] Did you have much trouble learning Fijian?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And so. So for example, [speaks Fijian], right? I'm full or I'm hungry in the nandrolone dialect is [speaks Fijian]. So it's just, it's just different. Even grammatically, there's some structural differences so that the present tense indicator is at the end of the sentence. So there's enough changes both in the grammar, the lexicon, and just the sounds, the phonics of it.

[Assistant] Did you have much trouble learning Fijian?

[User] Uh, probably learning well, just because most people's English was better than my Fijian would ever get. So they would typically speak to me in English, and if we were actually doing something official or business as opposed to actually just sort of banter or practicing with the language, mostly it was in English. So it was kind of on my own as more of a hobby. And I, all throughout, I was trying to learn the dialect and actually put together a little tiny dictionary of about three pages of words and phrases for volunteers that were going to follow behind me.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] In the area. But I never got. In retrospect, I wish I would have made more effort to learn the dialect because that's what they could understand the standard Fijian.

[Assistant] That's what endears you to the people, I think.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Uh, probably learning well, just because most people's English was better than my Fijian would ever get. So they would typically speak to me in English, and if we were actually doing something official or business as opposed to actually just sort of banter or practicing with the language, mostly it was in English. So it was kind of on my own as more of a hobby. And I, all throughout, I was trying to learn the dialect and actually put together a little tiny dictionary of about three pages of words and phrases for volunteers that were going to follow behind me.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] In the area. But I never got. In retrospect, I wish I would have made more effort to learn the dialect because that's what they could understand the standard Fijian.

[Assistant] That's what endears you to the people, I think.

[User] Exactly.

[Assistant] And how were you received in the village when you first got there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] In the area. But I never got. In retrospect, I wish I would have made more effort to learn the dialect because that's what they could understand the standard Fijian.

[Assistant] That's what endears you to the people, I think.

[User] Exactly.

[Assistant] And how were you received in the village when you first got there?

[User] Definitely, definitely friendly. And we were supposed to have our own housing when we got there at that time, for the Fiji groups at the time, and there was not housing available for me yet. So I stayed with my counterpart's family.

[Assistant] Counterpart being somebody else at the office?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Definitely, definitely friendly. And we were supposed to have our own housing when we got there at that time, for the Fiji groups at the time, and there was not housing available for me yet. So I stayed with my counterpart's family.

[Assistant] Counterpart being somebody else at the office?

[User] No, the counterpart is sort of my main coworker, the main person.

[Assistant] Fijian counterpart?

[User] Fijian counterpart, exactly, my main contact in the village. The person that I worked most closely with through the two years. And so, yeah, we definitely had the, certainly had the sevusevu.

[Assistant] I'm sure you did. How long do you recall staying with him before you did get another place?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Fijian counterpart, exactly, my main contact in the village. The person that I worked most closely with through the two years. And so, yeah, we definitely had the, certainly had the sevusevu.

[Assistant] I'm sure you did. How long do you recall staying with him before you did get another place?

[User] It was about four months.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] And that was a, that was a stressor for my time. Just because if I knew all along it was going to be with a host family, then it would have been fine. But the expectation was to have my own space and.

[Assistant] Oh, I see.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And that was a, that was a stressor for my time. Just because if I knew all along it was going to be with a host family, then it would have been fine. But the expectation was to have my own space and.

[Assistant] Oh, I see.

[User] And in a cross-cultural setting, it's kind of nice to have a home base where you can just kind of decompress and relax. And especially I'm more on the introverted side.

[Assistant] Really?

[User] So Fijian culture is not on the introverted side. Really social.

[Assistant] It's probably where I picked it up.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And in a cross-cultural setting, it's kind of nice to have a home base where you can just kind of decompress and relax. And especially I'm more on the introverted side.

[Assistant] Really?

[User] So Fijian culture is not on the introverted side. Really social.

[Assistant] It's probably where I picked it up.

[User] You might have fit very well. So it's. So that was a point of contention. I actually left my site for a few weeks and was potentially going to move to another site. And they said, OK, no, wait, we've got a place for you.

[Assistant] Oh, that's good.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So Fijian culture is not on the introverted side. Really social.

[Assistant] It's probably where I picked it up.

[User] You might have fit very well. So it's. So that was a point of contention. I actually left my site for a few weeks and was potentially going to move to another site. And they said, OK, no, wait, we've got a place for you.

[Assistant] Oh, that's good.

[User] And fixed up one of the teacher's quarters at the primary school. So I ended up being living on the just outside of the village on the school grounds.

[Assistant] Nice. So what would an ordinary day look like?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You might have fit very well. So it's. So that was a point of contention. I actually left my site for a few weeks and was potentially going to move to another site. And they said, OK, no, wait, we've got a place for you.

[Assistant] Oh, that's good.

[User] And fixed up one of the teacher's quarters at the primary school. So I ended up being living on the just outside of the village on the school grounds.

[Assistant] Nice. So what would an ordinary day look like?

[User] Oh, that's a great question.

[Assistant] If there is such a thing.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And fixed up one of the teacher's quarters at the primary school. So I ended up being living on the just outside of the village on the school grounds.

[Assistant] Nice. So what would an ordinary day look like?

[User] Oh, that's a great question.

[Assistant] If there is such a thing.

[User] There wasn't. Yeah. One day a week there would be community work. And that's, I think, was usually Mondays.

[Assistant] Like farming or what?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There wasn't. Yeah. One day a week there would be community work. And that's, I think, was usually Mondays.

[Assistant] Like farming or what?

[User] If it was cutting the grass or clearing the ibulubulu, the cemetery there.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah.

[User] So it would be kind of whatever the community had going on.

[Assistant] OK, so that was one day of the week.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] If it was cutting the grass or clearing the ibulubulu, the cemetery there.

[Assistant] Oh, yeah.

[User] So it would be kind of whatever the community had going on.

[Assistant] OK, so that was one day of the week.

[User] So that was one day. And then like I think a lot of Peace Corps volunteers, I feel like my biggest job was figuring out what my job was supposed to be. And so what I ended up kind of shaping was, since I was at the school and there was certainly a need at the school. Well, teacher was not part of the job description or anything, I just found a need there. So I actually organized the books in the library and started a checkout system and started an environment club for middle schoolers.

[Assistant] Middle school. OK, so what ages would that have been?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So it would be kind of whatever the community had going on.

[Assistant] OK, so that was one day of the week.

[User] So that was one day. And then like I think a lot of Peace Corps volunteers, I feel like my biggest job was figuring out what my job was supposed to be. And so what I ended up kind of shaping was, since I was at the school and there was certainly a need at the school. Well, teacher was not part of the job description or anything, I just found a need there. So I actually organized the books in the library and started a checkout system and started an environment club for middle schoolers.

[Assistant] Middle school. OK, so what ages would that have been?

[User] So it would have been. The school was equivalent of like first through eighth grade. So it would, it was primarily 12, 13 year olds.

[Assistant] So sixth, seventh, eighth.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So that was one day. And then like I think a lot of Peace Corps volunteers, I feel like my biggest job was figuring out what my job was supposed to be. And so what I ended up kind of shaping was, since I was at the school and there was certainly a need at the school. Well, teacher was not part of the job description or anything, I just found a need there. So I actually organized the books in the library and started a checkout system and started an environment club for middle schoolers.

[Assistant] Middle school. OK, so what ages would that have been?

[User] So it would have been. The school was equivalent of like first through eighth grade. So it would, it was primarily 12, 13 year olds.

[Assistant] So sixth, seventh, eighth.

[User] Exactly.

[Assistant] As we understand.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So it would have been. The school was equivalent of like first through eighth grade. So it would, it was primarily 12, 13 year olds.

[Assistant] So sixth, seventh, eighth.

[User] Exactly.

[Assistant] As we understand.

[User] Yeah, yeah. And so that was about. And I worked with the slow English readers as well, just giving them some one-on-one time. And so that equated to about two full days a week. And then really the other days there was nothing standard. There was nothing.

[Assistant] Except Sunday maybe.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Exactly.

[Assistant] As we understand.

[User] Yeah, yeah. And so that was about. And I worked with the slow English readers as well, just giving them some one-on-one time. And so that equated to about two full days a week. And then really the other days there was nothing standard. There was nothing.

[Assistant] Except Sunday maybe.

[User] Sunday was a day of rest.

[Assistant] Yeah. And church probably.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Sunday was a day of rest.

[Assistant] Yeah. And church probably.

[User] And church, absolutely. So I would typically go to the local church, which was Methodist.

[Assistant] Methodist, yeah.

[User] And then afterwards, we would usually go to someone's house and have a meal and sit and watch some rugby on TV.

[Assistant] That's a popular pastime.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And church, absolutely. So I would typically go to the local church, which was Methodist.

[Assistant] Methodist, yeah.

[User] And then afterwards, we would usually go to someone's house and have a meal and sit and watch some rugby on TV.

[Assistant] That's a popular pastime.

[User] Maybe a little different than your experience.

[Assistant] OK. You just said TV. Now we didn't have TV back in '78. Do you remember when it came about?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And then afterwards, we would usually go to someone's house and have a meal and sit and watch some rugby on TV.

[Assistant] That's a popular pastime.

[User] Maybe a little different than your experience.

[Assistant] OK. You just said TV. Now we didn't have TV back in '78. Do you remember when it came about?

[User] No.

[Assistant] But it was there when you got there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] No.

[Assistant] But it was there when you got there?

[User] It was there when I got there and it was primarily, um, people watch movies. So there were DVDs as well. But otherwise it was, Fiji One was the main channel. And then if it was, if it was other programing, kind of Western programing, it mainly came from

[Assistant] BBC?

[User] From New Zealand.

[Assistant] Oh, New Zealand.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] It was there when I got there and it was primarily, um, people watch movies. So there were DVDs as well. But otherwise it was, Fiji One was the main channel. And then if it was, if it was other programing, kind of Western programing, it mainly came from

[Assistant] BBC?

[User] From New Zealand.

[Assistant] Oh, New Zealand.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] New Zealand, Australia, about a thousand miles away each. So you had TV. That means you must have had electricity.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah.

[Assistant] New Zealand, Australia, about a thousand miles away each. So you had TV. That means you must have had electricity.

[User] I did. I did.

[Assistant] Lucky guy.

[User] I had electricity and most of the time I had running water.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. And lights I assume, with the electricity?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes.

[Assistant] OK.

[User] Yeah. Light. You know, really pretty, pretty nice housing, I even rented a refrigerator.

[Assistant] Oh, wow.

[User] While I was there, which was my finest luxury, and I don't regret it one day.

[Assistant] Yeah, you probably had lots of visitors. Were you able to keep anything cold in there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah. Light. You know, really pretty, pretty nice housing, I even rented a refrigerator.

[Assistant] Oh, wow.

[User] While I was there, which was my finest luxury, and I don't regret it one day.

[Assistant] Yeah, you probably had lots of visitors. Were you able to keep anything cold in there?

[User] Not, not too bad.

[Assistant] I'm alluding to Fiji beer.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] While I was there, which was my finest luxury, and I don't regret it one day.

[Assistant] Yeah, you probably had lots of visitors. Were you able to keep anything cold in there?

[User] Not, not too bad.

[Assistant] I'm alluding to Fiji beer.

[User] Yeah, little Fiji beer may have been in there occasionally. And then one other time a gecko got in there, which was, I don't know how he got in there.

[Assistant] A gecko like a little lizard?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Not, not too bad.

[Assistant] I'm alluding to Fiji beer.

[User] Yeah, little Fiji beer may have been in there occasionally. And then one other time a gecko got in there, which was, I don't know how he got in there.

[Assistant] A gecko like a little lizard?

[User] A little lizard, yeah, yeah. And the poor guy fell out of there all frozen because, yeah, being cold blooded. And then he had to thaw out and I saw him kind of scamper his way back up, back up the wall. But oh, it was nice.

[Assistant] And what did you do for fun in your pastime?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yeah, little Fiji beer may have been in there occasionally. And then one other time a gecko got in there, which was, I don't know how he got in there.

[Assistant] A gecko like a little lizard?

[User] A little lizard, yeah, yeah. And the poor guy fell out of there all frozen because, yeah, being cold blooded. And then he had to thaw out and I saw him kind of scamper his way back up, back up the wall. But oh, it was nice.

[Assistant] And what did you do for fun in your pastime?

[User] So you mentioned drinking kava, so there would often be, right, if you just kind of stroll through the village and they'd call out in our dialect, dua na bilo.

[Assistant] A bilo is a bowl.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] A little lizard, yeah, yeah. And the poor guy fell out of there all frozen because, yeah, being cold blooded. And then he had to thaw out and I saw him kind of scamper his way back up, back up the wall. But oh, it was nice.

[Assistant] And what did you do for fun in your pastime?

[User] So you mentioned drinking kava, so there would often be, right, if you just kind of stroll through the village and they'd call out in our dialect, dua na bilo.

[Assistant] A bilo is a bowl.

[User] One cup. Well, come have one cup of kava and.

[Assistant] A coconut bowl, right?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So you mentioned drinking kava, so there would often be, right, if you just kind of stroll through the village and they'd call out in our dialect, dua na bilo.

[Assistant] A bilo is a bowl.

[User] One cup. Well, come have one cup of kava and.

[Assistant] A coconut bowl, right?

[User] Exactly, exactly, about half of a coconut shell. And for whatever reason, you just sort of kind of walk back and forth and don't go in right away and then finally go in and you, gosh, you can sit there for quite a while. So that ended up passing the time quite a bit. I really loved learning the language, and so I absorbed whatever I could by book and by listening to it. But again, that was the standard Fijian, so it was a little harder.

[Assistant] Do you remember singing or music?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] One cup. Well, come have one cup of kava and.

[Assistant] A coconut bowl, right?

[User] Exactly, exactly, about half of a coconut shell. And for whatever reason, you just sort of kind of walk back and forth and don't go in right away and then finally go in and you, gosh, you can sit there for quite a while. So that ended up passing the time quite a bit. I really loved learning the language, and so I absorbed whatever I could by book and by listening to it. But again, that was the standard Fijian, so it was a little harder.

[Assistant] Do you remember singing or music?

[User] Mostly at church. And I didn't do. I played the saxophone, but I didn't take the saxophone there.

[Assistant] Oh, that's too bad, they would have loved that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Exactly, exactly, about half of a coconut shell. And for whatever reason, you just sort of kind of walk back and forth and don't go in right away and then finally go in and you, gosh, you can sit there for quite a while. So that ended up passing the time quite a bit. I really loved learning the language, and so I absorbed whatever I could by book and by listening to it. But again, that was the standard Fijian, so it was a little harder.

[Assistant] Do you remember singing or music?

[User] Mostly at church. And I didn't do. I played the saxophone, but I didn't take the saxophone there.

[Assistant] Oh, that's too bad, they would have loved that.

[User] I bet they would have.

[Assistant] Was there a guitar in the village that people played while you're sitting in the circle drinking kava?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Mostly at church. And I didn't do. I played the saxophone, but I didn't take the saxophone there.

[Assistant] Oh, that's too bad, they would have loved that.

[User] I bet they would have.

[Assistant] Was there a guitar in the village that people played while you're sitting in the circle drinking kava?

[User] You know, I feel like I saw more of that when I visited some of the other volunteers.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. Because that would have been my story.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I bet they would have.

[Assistant] Was there a guitar in the village that people played while you're sitting in the circle drinking kava?

[User] You know, I feel like I saw more of that when I visited some of the other volunteers.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. Because that would have been my story.

[User] Oh.

[Assistant] Largely related to music.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You know, I feel like I saw more of that when I visited some of the other volunteers.

[Assistant] Oh, OK. Because that would have been my story.

[User] Oh.

[Assistant] Largely related to music.

[User] What a great way to integrate.

[Assistant] It was. It was a good key to the culture. So back to work. So what did you do on a daily basis for work?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Oh.

[Assistant] Largely related to music.

[User] What a great way to integrate.

[Assistant] It was. It was a good key to the culture. So back to work. So what did you do on a daily basis for work?

[User] So the school was, and I really struggled with that. I think as Americans we're trained to be productive, to value productivity, to ride that through schooling. That's how you achieve. And the Peace Corps is such an astonishing wakeup call in that regard, because I can't speak for all volunteers, but I sure was not feeling productive. And on a day-to-day basis, usually we know what we need to work on and we go set out to it and we can get it done. And there, it just was difficult to figure it out. What? So, you know, the village did have to request a volunteer, but I think really they only had about two or three months' worth of work that they had in mind. Setting up a waste management workshop and some follow up with some non-profits, some non-governmental organizations, NGOs, that had done some work in the area and so.

[Assistant] Well, waste management would be a big deal in the village. What did you have, pit latrines or?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] What a great way to integrate.

[Assistant] It was. It was a good key to the culture. So back to work. So what did you do on a daily basis for work?

[User] So the school was, and I really struggled with that. I think as Americans we're trained to be productive, to value productivity, to ride that through schooling. That's how you achieve. And the Peace Corps is such an astonishing wakeup call in that regard, because I can't speak for all volunteers, but I sure was not feeling productive. And on a day-to-day basis, usually we know what we need to work on and we go set out to it and we can get it done. And there, it just was difficult to figure it out. What? So, you know, the village did have to request a volunteer, but I think really they only had about two or three months' worth of work that they had in mind. Setting up a waste management workshop and some follow up with some non-profits, some non-governmental organizations, NGOs, that had done some work in the area and so.

[Assistant] Well, waste management would be a big deal in the village. What did you have, pit latrines or?

[User] So they were on a, you know, septic system. So it, really it wasn't a huge issue. It was a, in terms of Fiji, it was a wealthy village because they own the land. The tokatoka, the kinship group, owns the land that the Fijian resort is on.

[Assistant] Oh boy, they get some premiums from that, huh?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So they were on a, you know, septic system. So it, really it wasn't a huge issue. It was a, in terms of Fiji, it was a wealthy village because they own the land. The tokatoka, the kinship group, owns the land that the Fijian resort is on.

[Assistant] Oh boy, they get some premiums from that, huh?

[User] Right. So it was a little different. So trying to carve out a Peace Corps volunteer generalist at best, right? I didn't know what I was doing in terms of waste management, coming out of school with a history degree and then working for the Army and air defense artillery. So it didn't exactly equate to waste management. So I was kind of trying to get one chapter ahead. And so that took some time. And so we did that. We set up the workshop and then tried to, from that workshop, tried to follow up on some ideas that that these different villages. I mentioned I worked in six or seven villages. And it just didn't, it just didn't end up being that much work.

[Assistant] Well, six or seven villages, I can only imagine the coordination and the power structure. How did that work with the chiefs?

[User] Sure. Well, with Cuvu village being the chiefly village of the whole province, it was the traditionally, right, the most powerful village.

[Assistant] And your chief would be the high chief.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. So it was a little different. So trying to carve out a Peace Corps volunteer generalist at best, right? I didn't know what I was doing in terms of waste management, coming out of school with a history degree and then working for the Army and air defense artillery. So it didn't exactly equate to waste management. So I was kind of trying to get one chapter ahead. And so that took some time. And so we did that. We set up the workshop and then tried to, from that workshop, tried to follow up on some ideas that that these different villages. I mentioned I worked in six or seven villages. And it just didn't, it just didn't end up being that much work.

[Assistant] Well, six or seven villages, I can only imagine the coordination and the power structure. How did that work with the chiefs?

[User] Sure. Well, with Cuvu village being the chiefly village of the whole province, it was the traditionally, right, the most powerful village.

[Assistant] And your chief would be the high chief.

[User] Exactly, exactly. And so if the traditional structure came into play, then that was fairly, fairly simple. Easy. You could go talk with the person at the top. From village to village, though, I would work with the rokotuli, which is sort of loosely translated as the village headman. It's kind of a funny way. I love that translation, but kind of the mayor.

[Assistant] Right. Well, iliuliu does mean chief so.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Sure. Well, with Cuvu village being the chiefly village of the whole province, it was the traditionally, right, the most powerful village.

[Assistant] And your chief would be the high chief.

[User] Exactly, exactly. And so if the traditional structure came into play, then that was fairly, fairly simple. Easy. You could go talk with the person at the top. From village to village, though, I would work with the rokotuli, which is sort of loosely translated as the village headman. It's kind of a funny way. I love that translation, but kind of the mayor.

[Assistant] Right. Well, iliuliu does mean chief so.

[User] Right, right. So it's an elected, but an elected position.

[Assistant] Oh, well, that's interesting. Yeah. And did he have, did the chief have a mata ni vanua, the spokesman that would generally accompany him on all visits?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Exactly, exactly. And so if the traditional structure came into play, then that was fairly, fairly simple. Easy. You could go talk with the person at the top. From village to village, though, I would work with the rokotuli, which is sort of loosely translated as the village headman. It's kind of a funny way. I love that translation, but kind of the mayor.

[Assistant] Right. Well, iliuliu does mean chief so.

[User] Right, right. So it's an elected, but an elected position.

[Assistant] Oh, well, that's interesting. Yeah. And did he have, did the chief have a mata ni vanua, the spokesman that would generally accompany him on all visits?

[User] Yes. Yeah, that was built into it. And I, you know, I don't think it was ever specifically explained to me. Like there he goes. But being at some of these large, large ceremonies, in fact, when Ratu Mara, former prime minister, when his wife died and she was connected to my village, there was a giant ceremony attended from all over the islands and other countries.

[Assistant] How many days did that last?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right, right. So it's an elected, but an elected position.

[Assistant] Oh, well, that's interesting. Yeah. And did he have, did the chief have a mata ni vanua, the spokesman that would generally accompany him on all visits?

[User] Yes. Yeah, that was built into it. And I, you know, I don't think it was ever specifically explained to me. Like there he goes. But being at some of these large, large ceremonies, in fact, when Ratu Mara, former prime minister, when his wife died and she was connected to my village, there was a giant ceremony attended from all over the islands and other countries.

[Assistant] How many days did that last?

[User] The event itself was one day.

[Assistant] One day. But the gathering, yeah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Yeah, that was built into it. And I, you know, I don't think it was ever specifically explained to me. Like there he goes. But being at some of these large, large ceremonies, in fact, when Ratu Mara, former prime minister, when his wife died and she was connected to my village, there was a giant ceremony attended from all over the islands and other countries.

[Assistant] How many days did that last?

[User] The event itself was one day.

[Assistant] One day. But the gathering, yeah.

[User] Giant gathering and offering of gifts to the chief, the provincial chief. Yeah, so who exactly that was. And at different events, it would kind of be different people and it's probably who was there, but there was certainly the mata ni vanua role being served.

[Assistant] I'm sure there was. Yeah, I recall a wailing tent from one of the funerals I attended where the women would just go into the tent and the most blood curdling scream would come out of this tent. The men wouldn't go. The men would be sitting there drinking coffee.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] The event itself was one day.

[Assistant] One day. But the gathering, yeah.

[User] Giant gathering and offering of gifts to the chief, the provincial chief. Yeah, so who exactly that was. And at different events, it would kind of be different people and it's probably who was there, but there was certainly the mata ni vanua role being served.

[Assistant] I'm sure there was. Yeah, I recall a wailing tent from one of the funerals I attended where the women would just go into the tent and the most blood curdling scream would come out of this tent. The men wouldn't go. The men would be sitting there drinking coffee.

[User] They would drink coffee all day.

[Assistant] While the women wailed.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Giant gathering and offering of gifts to the chief, the provincial chief. Yeah, so who exactly that was. And at different events, it would kind of be different people and it's probably who was there, but there was certainly the mata ni vanua role being served.

[Assistant] I'm sure there was. Yeah, I recall a wailing tent from one of the funerals I attended where the women would just go into the tent and the most blood curdling scream would come out of this tent. The men wouldn't go. The men would be sitting there drinking coffee.

[User] They would drink coffee all day.

[Assistant] While the women wailed.

[User] Right. There was, I mean, for, they definitely the big ceremonies or funerals, weddings, first birthdays.

[Assistant] And church holidays?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Right. There was, I mean, for, they definitely the big ceremonies or funerals, weddings, first birthdays.

[Assistant] And church holidays?

[User] Church holidays, around Christmas was very, very big. But they could kind of blend in your mind because most of it was sitting and drinking kava.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] There'd be some nuances to the ceremony. And of course, the words would be different. But the procedure was very similar. But, you know, that was a really neat thing about being in the village while finding work and knowing where I could be valuable. Being, you know, barely being as competent as a two year old in terms of Fijian culture and the local politics and dynamics. So quickly realizing, and I don't think I suffered illusions that I was going to be extremely knowledgeable technically to help out. But while that was a challenge, the benefit was being immersed in the culture. And even though a lot of people in my village went to work six days a week because it was pretty well.

[Assistant] Did they work in the village or outside the village?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] There'd be some nuances to the ceremony. And of course, the words would be different. But the procedure was very similar. But, you know, that was a really neat thing about being in the village while finding work and knowing where I could be valuable. Being, you know, barely being as competent as a two year old in terms of Fijian culture and the local politics and dynamics. So quickly realizing, and I don't think I suffered illusions that I was going to be extremely knowledgeable technically to help out. But while that was a challenge, the benefit was being immersed in the culture. And even though a lot of people in my village went to work six days a week because it was pretty well.

[Assistant] Did they work in the village or outside the village?

[User] Outside. So in the various resorts.

[Assistant] Ah, yes.

[User] Because my village was pretty well integrated into the cash economy. And so that makes for an interesting dynamic, right, for a Peace Corps volunteer. So it's not like going into a subsistence setting and figuring out a nice project scope. It's instead trying to figure out what's going to enhance the wellbeing of these communities that, right, they're still immersed in Fijian culture. One foot there, but also one foot in going to work. Going to work every day or six days a week and, you know, having to earn some cash.

[Assistant] Yeah. And who did you report to?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Because my village was pretty well integrated into the cash economy. And so that makes for an interesting dynamic, right, for a Peace Corps volunteer. So it's not like going into a subsistence setting and figuring out a nice project scope. It's instead trying to figure out what's going to enhance the wellbeing of these communities that, right, they're still immersed in Fijian culture. One foot there, but also one foot in going to work. Going to work every day or six days a week and, you know, having to earn some cash.

[Assistant] Yeah. And who did you report to?

[User] I reported to a man, so my site supervisor in the village.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] So I had a counterpart, a site Fijian counterpart, and then a Fijian supervisor. And so those were the, and they were brothers. So those were the two men who were kind of in charge of putting me to work or keeping me out of trouble. Yeah.

[Assistant] Interesting. OK. Well, so you spent two years there?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] I reported to a man, so my site supervisor in the village.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] So I had a counterpart, a site Fijian counterpart, and then a Fijian supervisor. And so those were the, and they were brothers. So those were the two men who were kind of in charge of putting me to work or keeping me out of trouble. Yeah.

[Assistant] Interesting. OK. Well, so you spent two years there?

[User] Yes. Yes, I did the two years.

[Assistant] And do you recall your feelings as you prepared to leave Fiji?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So I had a counterpart, a site Fijian counterpart, and then a Fijian supervisor. And so those were the, and they were brothers. So those were the two men who were kind of in charge of putting me to work or keeping me out of trouble. Yeah.

[Assistant] Interesting. OK. Well, so you spent two years there?

[User] Yes. Yes, I did the two years.

[Assistant] And do you recall your feelings as you prepared to leave Fiji?

[User] So leaving Fiji. You know, I think that first, after the first year at the halfway point, I definitely had a little bit of a meltdown. And I think I had not quite shed all of my American values around that productivity. And so you're just wondering, wow, this is stressful, right? Because I'm pretty capable. I'm pretty competent in an American setting. And that's, you know, eye-opening about living a cross-cultural life and being immersed, is you don't feel competent.

[Assistant] You're kind of starting over.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Yes. Yes, I did the two years.

[Assistant] And do you recall your feelings as you prepared to leave Fiji?

[User] So leaving Fiji. You know, I think that first, after the first year at the halfway point, I definitely had a little bit of a meltdown. And I think I had not quite shed all of my American values around that productivity. And so you're just wondering, wow, this is stressful, right? Because I'm pretty capable. I'm pretty competent in an American setting. And that's, you know, eye-opening about living a cross-cultural life and being immersed, is you don't feel competent.

[Assistant] You're kind of starting over.

[User] You're starting over. Your jokes aren't funny.

[Assistant] Especially in another language.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] So leaving Fiji. You know, I think that first, after the first year at the halfway point, I definitely had a little bit of a meltdown. And I think I had not quite shed all of my American values around that productivity. And so you're just wondering, wow, this is stressful, right? Because I'm pretty capable. I'm pretty competent in an American setting. And that's, you know, eye-opening about living a cross-cultural life and being immersed, is you don't feel competent.

[Assistant] You're kind of starting over.

[User] You're starting over. Your jokes aren't funny.

[Assistant] Especially in another language.

[User] In another language. You got to learn so much in the context, and um.

[Assistant] I have to share one joke with you.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] You're starting over. Your jokes aren't funny.

[Assistant] Especially in another language.

[User] In another language. You got to learn so much in the context, and um.

[Assistant] I have to share one joke with you.

[User] Of course.

[Assistant] Since the Fijians used to be cannibals, the last guy to get eaten was the missionary, but their biggest insult is, we wouldn't even want to eat you. And I'd say, oh please, just a little bite.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Of course.

[Assistant] Since the Fijians used to be cannibals, the last guy to get eaten was the missionary, but their biggest insult is, we wouldn't even want to eat you. And I'd say, oh please, just a little bite.

[User] And I can see, I bet that was funny the entire time.

[Assistant] Pretty much.

[User] And so it just, it takes learning that. And so at the one year mark, I don't, I didn't think seriously about leaving, but we started with 34 volunteers in our, at the beginning of training, and we finished at the two year mark, I think, with 24. So it was, you know, pretty decent amount lost. And yeah, I feel like that was maybe because it was so uncertain that I think the sites at this time, because Fiji, the program closed down from '98 to 2001 or 2002.

[Assistant] Oh, that's right, I forgot about that.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And I don't think. I don't know exactly why. I think it might have just been reallocating resources, but then it opened up in I think 2003. So we were the third group after the program reopened. So we were called FRE-3.

[Assistant] Free three?

[User] F-R-E dash 3, Fiji Re-Entry Three.

[Assistant] Oh, OK.

[User] Which I think the program has gone back to the more chronological numbers which I think was really great so you had the continuity. So that was really, that was hard for me. And the second year, I guess in a way, I'd say I got it finally. Quit taking myself so seriously, right? Shed that Army command and control that I had been trained to do.

[Assistant] Oh, oh yeah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Of moving things forward, of being able to see that progress. And stepping back and saying, let's just, let's just roll with it. What do the folks I'm working with want to work on? I have this little bit of structure at the school. So, great. That made a big difference. So I did know I had at least 15 to 20 hours established, so that second year was just much more relaxing.

[Assistant] That's good.

[User] And so that coming to the end, you know, there was definitely some relief just because it's, for me being immersed in that Fijian culture and that social communal aspect, which is so awesome, so amazing. But hard for someone who doesn't mind some solitude and solo time. So there was definitely a relief. And definitely also real sadness to be leaving these people I'd gotten real close to, including other volunteers.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Such an important network of volunteers and fellow teachers and people I worked with in the village, people in some of the non- governmental organizations. You know, I think moving on from anything is really tough in the sort of the emotional cauldron of Peace Corps. I think that's even more, that's even more powerful. So it was a real mix. And I remember, you know, we talked about drinking quite a bit of kava. So even the last day, a fairly large contingent, probably 10 or so, we actually all came to the airport with me and we sat out on a tiny little strip of grass out in the parking lot and had a couple more tanoas, a couple more bowls.

[Assistant] Bowls of grog, yeah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] And so that coming to the end, you know, there was definitely some relief just because it's, for me being immersed in that Fijian culture and that social communal aspect, which is so awesome, so amazing. But hard for someone who doesn't mind some solitude and solo time. So there was definitely a relief. And definitely also real sadness to be leaving these people I'd gotten real close to, including other volunteers.

[Assistant] Yeah.

[User] Such an important network of volunteers and fellow teachers and people I worked with in the village, people in some of the non- governmental organizations. You know, I think moving on from anything is really tough in the sort of the emotional cauldron of Peace Corps. I think that's even more, that's even more powerful. So it was a real mix. And I remember, you know, we talked about drinking quite a bit of kava. So even the last day, a fairly large contingent, probably 10 or so, we actually all came to the airport with me and we sat out on a tiny little strip of grass out in the parking lot and had a couple more tanoas, a couple more bowls.

[Assistant] Bowls of grog, yeah.

[User] Of kava before I went and checked in. So definitely a lot of tears.

[Assistant] On both sides, yeah.


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Such an important network of volunteers and fellow teachers and people I worked with in the village, people in some of the non- governmental organizations. You know, I think moving on from anything is really tough in the sort of the emotional cauldron of Peace Corps. I think that's even more, that's even more powerful. So it was a real mix. And I remember, you know, we talked about drinking quite a bit of kava. So even the last day, a fairly large contingent, probably 10 or so, we actually all came to the airport with me and we sat out on a tiny little strip of grass out in the parking lot and had a couple more tanoas, a couple more bowls.

[Assistant] Bowls of grog, yeah.

[User] Of kava before I went and checked in. So definitely a lot of tears.

[Assistant] On both sides, yeah.

[User] On both sides. And so, yeah, hard. But it was also, I'll admit, definitely a sense of relief when I got on that plane. And it was just kind of like, wow, OK. It's just such a powerful experience.

[Assistant] Did they have a nickname for you?


[System] Act as an information elicitation agent for oral history.

[User] Of kava before I went and checked in. So definitely a lot of tears.

[Assistant] On both sides, yeah.

[User] On both sides. And so, yeah, hard. But it was also, I'll admit, definitely a sense of relief when I got on that plane. And it was just kind of like, wow, OK. It's just such a powerful experience.

[Assistant] Did they have a nickname for you?

[User] Well, just my name. So Paul in Fijian is Vaula or Paula. So being a biblical name, it's pretty common there too. But it, of course, it sounds like Paula, which takes some getting used to, and the Fijian women, you know, would often singsong-y voice if they were calling out to me as I'm walking down the road. They'd say, Paulaaaaa. And so that still rings in my ear.

[Assistant] I'm getting tingles just hearing that, because that flashed back.